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cial credit peak circa 1985 credit and economic growth peaks in 1959 and 2017 debt and economic growth peak in 2019 with end of data credit and debt and debt and credit good credit usage now half what is was in the early 1800s at march 18 2022 1 comment email this blogthis share to x share to facebook share to pinterest thursday march 17 2022 found by accident drew my attention immediately in the long run we are all dead keynesianism political economy and revolution pdf 362 pages by geoff mann 2017 the heading on page 58 a general theory of civilization page 59 keynes became a keynesian not to save capitalism or liberalism per se but to save the thin and precarious crust of civilization itself he was to be sure a capitalist and he believed that something like capitalism although in a more or less radically different form would be a central pillar in the construction of more robust peaceful and secure social formation but to read his commitment to capitalism as his priority is to misunderstand his politics and that of many elites of his time he understood capitalism to be intimately interwoven with but not identical to civilization his work especially but not only the general theory is an attempt to do via economics what since the french revolution others had tried to do through other modes of analysis philosophical political even literary to understand the ways in which modernity puts civilization at risk and to uncover the means by which we might rescue civilization from modernity s self destructive tendencies i find just two occurrences of the word civilisation in keynes s general theory in chapter 10 at periods when gold is available at suitable depths experience shows that the real wealth of the world increases rapidly and when but little of it is so available our wealth suffers stagnation or decline thus gold mines are of the greatest value and importance to civilisation but do read the whole paragraph and in chapter 23 but here keynes is quoting someone else someone he disagrees with recommended reading the whole chapter keynes uses the word civilisation once in the book based on that one usage it is clear that keynes does see a strong link between civilization and the economy but it would be a mistake to say the general theory is a book about saving civilization it is about fixing the economy it might not be wrong to say the book was motivated by the desire to save civilization though i don t expect keynes said any such thing and it is certainly reasonable to look at all of keynes s work not only the gt to see how he ties civilization and the economy together this is what i think mann is doing but i need to see those quotes at march 17 2022 no comments email this blogthis share to x share to facebook share to pinterest wednesday march 16 2022 a specifically evolutionary phenomenon in the long run we are all dead keynesianism political economy and revolution pdf 362 pages by geoff mann 2017 from note 15 for chapter 1 there is a great deal that separates freud from keynes and keynesianism but it is nonetheless true that on the question of civilization keynes thought along lines almost exactly the same as those laid out by freud in civilization and its discontents freud posits civilization kultur as a specifically evolutionary phenomenon keynes shared freud s contentions that the replacement of the power of the individual by the power of a community constitutes the decisive step in civilization that human life in common is only made possible when a majority comes together which is stronger than any separate individual and which remains united against all separate individuals freud clearly helped him keynes think and see things in a new light okay when mann says keynes thought along lines almost exactly the same as those laid out by freud and when he says keynes shared freud s contentions these are mann s observations not keynes s i don t know what keynes thinks until i see keynes saying it himself and sometimes not even then so my objection to mann s words here is the same as in mine of the 14th mann is presenting his own theory and calling it keynes s however mine of the 14th quotes a fragment from mann s preface and today s quote is part of a footnote neither quote is part of the main body of the book but even if they were those quotes are not evidence that mann doesn t show keynes expressing the same ideas himself they are not evidence that keynes does say those things but they are also not evidence that keynes doesn t say those things i get that but those quotes are evidence that mann is saying keynes says those things and this for me is a barrier to my acceptance of the thought that i want to accept which is that keynes did say those things mann plants the idea in my mind when he says keynes said it he makes me think keynes said it but he has shown me no evidence that keynes said it i am in danger of accepting without evidence the idea that keynes said some particular thing my only rational response is to distrust the source of this information mann my reaction of the 14th was to distrust the source a better reaction would have been to look for better evidence that s what i ve been doing since the 14th today i present a quote that i like a lot but i still don t see evidence that keynes thought those things today s quote from the footnote is important to me because of the ideas it contains i think civilization is a specifically evolutionary phenomenon though i would omit the word specifically because it complicates the idea i think it is true that replacement of the power of the individual by the power of a community constitutes the decisive step in civilization i also think athelstan s grately code is an example and was a big part of that replacement of power i think freud s contention regarding a majority versus separate individuals is fascinating but i neither accept nor reject it at this time and i still don t see keynes saying he shared freud s contentions mann gives me no reason to be convinced that keynes thought along similar lines i keep thinking about the boss at my old job whenever he wanted us to do something he s say steve wants you to do it steve was the boss s boss people would stop challenging the boss s orders and just do the work when the boss said steve wants it but that doesn t mean steve wanted what the boss said he wanted saying steve wants it was just a way to get people to go along geoff mann uses that technique when he tells us what keynes was thinking geoff mann wants the reader to go along with what geoff mann is saying so geoff mann says keynes said it the main body of the book awaits at march 16 2022 1 comment email this blogthis share to x share to facebook share to pinterest tuesday march 15 2022 toynbee in one paragraph josé ortega y gasset quoted by geoff mann civilization is not simply here it is not self sustaining it is artificial and demands an artist or artisan if you want to enjoy the advantages of civilization but are not concerned with sustaining civilization well you are done in the blink of an eye you find yourself without civilization just a slip and when you look around everything has vanished into thin air at march 15 2022 1 comment email this blogthis share to x share to facebook share to pinterest monday march 14 2022 geoff mann s theory of keynes s theory of civilization in the long run we are all dead keynesianism political economy and revolution pdf 362 pages by geoff mann 2017 a google search search for keynes civilization turns up more than two million results including this in the number one spot i am stopped dead by the words keynes s theory of civilization keynes s theory of civilization you d think i d have heard of it before now i think somebody made it up somebody put the words in keynes s mouth hey i could be wrong about this we will see google search turns up a handful of results for the phrase as keynes s theory of civilization makes clear one of the results is a blurb page for the geoff mann book in the long run we are all dead the blurb says in part keynesians are not and never have been out to save capitalism but rather to save civilization from itself but it is not keynes saying this and even if it actually is a keynesian idea that doesn t mean it has anything to do with keynes but wait could saving civilization from itself be an obscure reference to the four words civilization dies by suicide hmm nah to save civilization we have to save capitalism carroll quigley would say or we have to come up with a better instrument of expansion right quick but carroll quigley is not keynes and i ve tried to find keynes talking about civilization and its troubles and yeah i found a few statements but it s always like pulling teeth i always feel like i m putting words in keynes s mouth this is why i distrust geoff mann when he puts civilization there one of the search results is a google book of the geoff mann book it turns up this snippet a sentence and a half without context and with no hint of a source or reference to where keynes might have offered such a theory two of the results link to a d d chat page at forums somethingawful com a quote from the geoff mann book by ronya who says mann is trying his best to steelman contemporary liberalism i had to look up steelman and one result links to a pdf of the geoff mann book so all this search effort was not a total waste at least i learned a new word rummaging i remember having looked before for something by geoff mann that i could read and make sense of without success as i recall i find nothing on this blog about mann before today nothing on mann on this blog nothing on the old blog and nothing posted on my test development blog though i have some notes and such saved as drafts i have the hardest time making sense of what mann says could be because he s very smart some reviews suggest this but if he was that smart he should be smart enough to explain it simply i have the einstein quote in my blog themes folder if you can t explain it simply you don t understand it well enough i struggle with that all the time 116 occurrences of the word civilization in the geoff mann book the first occurs in a paragraph on page 10 if keynesianism returned with the most recent crisis it is not because of keynes s theory of effective demand or his employment function but because climate change war and accelerating inequality seem to have put what many think of a civilization on the ropes and right there geoff mann puts the words in keynes s mouth he says many people think civilization is on the ropes those people mann says turned to keynesian economic policy in response to the financial crisis but this is not keynes s theory of civilization the monetary and fiscal policy response to the financial crisis of 2008 was kneejerk keynesianism what it showed is that a guy who has been dead since 1946 still understands the economy better than do our policymakers and the people they turn to for advice i reject mann s assumption that the financial crisis was just one of many problems including climate change war and accelerating inequality that seem to have put what many think of a civilization on the ropes i see bad economic policy as the one problem and the cause of all the problems mann lists what mann offers is a list of results of the bad policy problem and i reject what looks like mann s implicit dismissal of the idea that civilization is not on the ropes and why does he put the word civilization in quotes is he trying to deny that the word applies one sentence i can t get through one sentence that geoff mann writes without having a dozen problems with it here let me shorten his sentence if something happened it is because climate change war and accelerating inequality seem to have put what many think of a civilization on the ropes and shorter c limate change war and accelerating inequality seem to have put what many think of a civilization on the ropes do you see it put what many think of a civilization on the ropes something is wrong maybe he dropped the letter s maybe geoff mann meant to write put what many think of as civilization on the ropes maybe he did drop the s i dunno but how am i supposed to understand what he means to say if he says it with typos that obscure the meaning moreover this sentence of his seems to be central to the argument of his book though it is early yet for me to be drawing that conclusion how am i supposed to read and understand a guy who makes his key sentences unintelligible i can think of other ways to repair his sentence but i cannot repair his sentence as i do not know what he meant to say because he didn t say it in a grammatically correct sentence for want of a nail and all that mann s paragraph continues robespierre or hitler keynes understood them as two sides of the same populist coin might be right around the corner that sentence is offered as further evidence of civilization on the ropes i m not sure of the timing but geoff mann s book has a copyright date of 2017 which is the year of donald trump s inauguration that is at the very least an odd coincidence mann the panic that gripped europe and north america following the bankruptcy of lehman brothers in fall 2008 was partly motivated by rich people s frantic effort to stay rich but it was also motivated by lots of not that rich people s fears that we were at some tipping point in the social order decline of civilization again again the concern of many people who are not keynes so even if mann is right about the concern he is not right to attribute it to keynes who has been dead since 1946 in case i didn t make that clear before those people were not primarily trying to save capitalism they were trying to stave off a calamity caused by capitalism in the hope that something better will come along that is what keynesianism is and always has been all about mann makes assumptions about what people were hoping and what people were fearing he treats his assumptions as fact and he attributes these as facts to keynes and to keynesianism this is some bold bullshit far as i m concerned mann finishes his paragraph this book is a mostly sympathetic critique of that sensibility which i cannot help but see everywhere i look perhaps because i have yet been unable despite my best efforts to escape it completely myself so maybe these thoughts and hopes and fears that geoff mann attributes to keynes to keynesians and to many people are actually thoughts and hopes and fears that pester mann despite his best efforts to escape it completely okay so mann says people think the end is near he even thinks so himself why try to escape it own it don t try to convince us that you have almost completely escaped it don t attribute it to other people and above all else don t say it is all keynes s idea unless you damn well show keynes himself saying it i don t understand this geoff mann at all at march 14 2022 3 comments email this blogthis share 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