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48chief thursday november 7 2013 progress i have spent so much time dreaming about the day when my chief bottom end was finally put together for the final time well it s here this first picture shows the cams in and correctly timed this next picture shows the new pushrods and also illustrates a problem i had too little clearance even with the adjusters bottomed i called a fellow indian afficionado who has already saved my bacon once he asked me if i had the thick or the thin lock nuts turns out i had the thick ones so duff saved me by sending a set of four thin lock nuts as shown below between these and some home made 025 cylinder base gaskets i got the clearance i needed i hope to be able to install the rings and button up the cylinders this weekend stay tuned for further developments posted by flathead45 at 9 20 pm 0 comments email this blogthis share to x share to facebook share to pinterest monday october 7 2013 relieving the cases for 80 when i discovered i needed to replace the flywheels i decided to go from 74 to 80 displacement this involves several small operations most notably buying flywheels with a 3 8 increase in stroke as mentioned in previous posts the piston skirts needed to be shortened by about 0 250 and the heads had to be milled to clear the pistons at tdc the other modification involves relieving the cases to clear the rods at the front and back bitmonkey helped me do this gingerly by hand with a file we checked it by assembling the pistons on the rods and crank and then put the cylinders in place on just the right pinion side case half we ended up taking off about 125 from the front of the front cylinder opening and the same amount off of the back of the rear cylinder opening i was worried about clearing the lip on the cylinder but it was fine and we didn t have to relieve between cylinders either once we got the right case half relieved we simply relieved the left case half to match this pic shows how far down the pistons are at b d c the skirt actually extends about 3 8 below the cylinder and comes within about 100 of the case the final thing i checked was the clearance between the scraper and the flywheels shown below it s supposed to run within about 025 and i bent it up until i got the clearance right apparently this scraper is a 1947 only feature intended to make the scavenge pump work better in 48 and later they cast a special channel in the case halves to accomplish the same thing so i guess it worked posted by flathead45 at 9 31 pm 1 comments email this blogthis share to x share to facebook share to pinterest sunday september 29 2013 crank be true many aspects of the engine rebuild have been intimidating but none so much as the equally black arts of balancing and truing the crank i hired out the balancing to truett and osborn they have been in business since 1974 or so i am confident they have figured it out by now the work looks very thorough time will tell for the truing i relied on the expertise of fuzzy jamison owner of classic thunder a fellow seattle cossack and a good friend i also brought bitmonkey for moral support we used fuzzy s beautifully built rowe truing stand here s a little theory i read and re read my revised 2nd edition copy of trusty motorcycle mechanics and speed tuning circa 1939 there are three distinct ways in which the crank may be out of true probably more if any of the parts are damaged they are a this first kind of misalignment will result in peak readings when the crankpin is at the top or bottom above or below the drive shaft and pinion shafts or very nearly so the fix involves a well placed rap or multiple raps with a lead or brass hammer on the outer surface of the trailing wheel more or less 90 degrees from the crankpin do not do this with the crank in the truing stand watching someone beat on your immaculate flywheels is like watching an orthopedic surgeon set your child s femur not for the faint of heart get it as close as you can in this direction before going on to b or c both b and c will result in peak readings when the crankpin is near the same level as the drive shaft and pinion shafts motorcycle mechanics suggests a wedge to correct the misalignment shown in b fuzzy has ground a 5 16 nut and bolt to exactly the right length to slip in between the wheels and he spreads them with a pair of wrenches very controlled and precise c illustrates the need to squeeze the wheels at the arrows motorcycle mechanics suggests a vise for this but fuzzy used a large c clamp again very easy and precise we were very careful to loosen the dead centers on the truing stand each time we squeezed or spread the flywheels eventually fuzzy figured that bit monkey and i wouldn t hurt ourselves and left us to our own devices with about 2 1 2 hours invested we got the crank to 0005 half a thousandth on each side the indian overhaul manual calls for a maximum runout of 0 001 i am very pleased thanks very much to fuzzy and bitmonkey for the help i can t wait to see how it runs posted by flathead45 at 8 56 pm 2 comments email this blogthis share to x share to facebook share to pinterest monday june 24 2013 balance factor blog readers will know i am working on understanding balancing crank assemblies this was stolen shamelessly from jockey journal seems like a 60 balance factor keeps coming up s s supposedly uses 60 and paul osborn from truett and osborn told me he uses 60 unless the customer specifies otherwise posted by flathead45 at 10 03 pm 1 comments email this blogthis share to x share to facebook share to pinterest saturday june 1 2013 barn fresh this one is just perfectly crusty it sure makes me want to hear yours running again posted by bitmonkey at 9 47 pm 0 comments email this blogthis share to x share to facebook share to pinterest wednesday may 29 2013 stroked to 80 well i have come to a momentous decision because of my flywheel troubles see previous post it was recommended to me that i would be better off replacing the old flywheels with new ones since the primary cost of upgrading from 74 cubic inches to 80 cubic inches is the flywheels this caused some serious reflection the stock 74 has a bore and stroke of 3 25 x 4 4375 the 80 indian s last ditch attempt to resurrect flagging chief sales against the panhead came out in 1950 applying creativity in place of development indian achieved the 80 by stroking the 74 by 3 8 to 4 8125 this necessitated three or maybe four relatively simple changes 1 replace the flywheels 2 shorten the piston skirts 1 4 inch to keep them from hitting the case at bdc when i compared my new 74 pistons to the old pistons that came out i was curious as to why the old skirts were shorter turns out they were 80 pistons just for the record the old 80 pistons have a total height of just under 3 2 995 the new 74 pistons have a total height of just over 3 25 3 255 i m not sure i have the guts to throw the new 74 pistons on the lathe with my remedial machinist skills i think i will try to exchange them for 80 instead 3 cut a recess into the heads to accomodate the piston at tdc now sticking up 3 16 this is my stock 74 head note the lower part of the combustion chamber is flush with the gasket surface this is an 80 head note the cutout at the bottom to accommodate the pop up piston i may also need to relieve the cases at the cylinder bases to clear the rods a little bit not sure yet i am told the stock cams and followers will work just fine in the 80 although several different hot cams are available with names like bonneville shunk and ollie i took the plunge i ordered 80 kiwi flywheels manufactured by truett and osborn today and also sent my heads off to be machined hope i don t regret this posted by flathead45 at 5 48 pm 3 comments email this blogthis share to x share to facebook share to pinterest tuesday may 21 2013 crank woes i apologize in advance to the casual lurkers this post will be pretty esoteric i am trying to solve a couple of flywheel problems and want to share some pictures problem 1 the crankpin does not pull through as much on the drive side as the pinion side which appears to cause excessive side play at the rods when assembled with 067 thrust washers this picture below shows the pinion side of the crankpin torqued crankpin end is about 033 below the nut face not too bad this picture shows the problem end the drive side crankpin end crankpin end is about 067 below the nut face fully torqued note exposed threads on nut by reversing the pin i concluded that the problem seems to be in the drive side flywheel and not asymmetry in the crankpin itself the taper hole in the drive side flywheel seems to be of too small diameter this would also explain why the wheels seem too far apart and very thick thrust washers would be required to get the proper 020 side play on the rods might also explain why i found that the last rebulder ground down the drive side case race on the inner surface with an angle grinder to try to get proper crank end play with a too wide crank i would guess here is a photo of the outer surface of the drive side wheel note the z metal mark and that there is no stamped timing mark below is the outer surface of the pinion side wheel this one has a problem too when i insert and torque the new pinion shaft and then mount it in the lathe to check that the wheel is true to the pin i get about 015 wobble at the outer diameter note the z marking and the 84 casting tag note also that the balancing hole at the top of the picture is the only hole on this wheel and the other crank has no balance holes drilled anywhere the lack of drilled balance on one side makes me wonder if the wheeled are mismatched close up of the crooked pinion shaft taper i hope i can lap the new pinion shaft with a carefully indexed bridgeport and straighten this taper pinion side wheel inner surface drive side wheel inner surface close up of casting marks on pinion side wheel another close up of the pinion shaft taper note wear on lower right although the pinion shaft pulls in tight just not quite true posted by flathead45 at 7 44 pm 0 comments email this blogthis share to x share to facebook share to pinterest older posts home subscribe to posts atom 48 chief 38hdu geekbobber amca forums fast is fast greer 48 chief catalog matt olsen s blog kiwi indian bettie bicycle 1948 indian super chief mikes indian parts speedo shop starklite indian motorcycles virtual indian mailing list ziggy s indian parts the cycle shop seattle cossacks blog archive 2013 14 november 1 progress october 1 september 1 june 2 may 2 april 1 march 2 february 3 january 1 2012 83 december 4 november 1 october 5 september 5 august 4 july 7 june 2 may 3 april 5 march 7 february 9 january 31 2011 3 december 3 awesome inc theme powered by blogger